tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post114865952314385652..comments2024-03-25T19:00:40.046-06:00Comments on The Constructive Curmudgeon: American IdolatryDouglas Groothuis, Ph.D.http://www.blogger.com/profile/08766692378954258034noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1149196845666839702006-06-01T15:20:00.000-06:002006-06-01T15:20:00.000-06:00I appreciated this post so much, and found you via...I appreciated this post so much, and found you via Transforming Sermons today. The Lord has already convicted me of falling into the TV trap. Thanks for posting. I referenced you in my post today.Vickihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08601718675860240867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1149055875632771482006-05-31T00:11:00.000-06:002006-05-31T00:11:00.000-06:00If there is a literal Beast to come before the Esc...If there is a literal Beast to come before the Eschaton, you can be sure he will be on TV.Douglas Groothuis, Ph.D.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08766692378954258034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1149050567240415262006-05-30T22:42:00.000-06:002006-05-30T22:42:00.000-06:00I can't resist this quote, " 1Then I saw another b...I can't resist this quote, " 1Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon. He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed. He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men. And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life. And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed." (John recording the vision he was given on Patmos).<BR/><BR/>I have wondered for years what John would think of the shrines in our living rooms with speaking idols front and center!Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11768563138849587357noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148838881769747272006-05-28T11:54:00.000-06:002006-05-28T11:54:00.000-06:00Manual trackback:Douglas Groothuis, reflecting on ...Manual trackback:<BR/><BR/>Douglas Groothuis, reflecting on a popular television show with a surprisingly candid title, reminds us that idolatry is not dead in North America:Milton Stanleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09235705641913811166noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148786915852270622006-05-27T21:28:00.000-06:002006-05-27T21:28:00.000-06:00Nedric says:"After reading MacIntyre, if we accept...Nedric says:<BR/><BR/>"After reading MacIntyre, if we accept the idea that humans are story-telling animals, and that stories are fictions (or at least highly selective and edited versions of "reality"), then doesn't the distinction between real and idol dissolve? "<BR/><BR/>It is hard to know where to start with something so thickly larded with error, frankly. But:<BR/><BR/>1. If Ned's statement itself is a fiction, why bother worrying about it? Why apply it across the board?<BR/><BR/>2. If MacIntrye's nonrealism is wrong, which it is, then the problem Ned raises doesn't obtain.<BR/><BR/>3. There are many reasons to think nonrealism is wrong. Logically necessary truths cannot be fictions or constructions:<BR/><BR/>a. The law of noncontradiction<BR/>b. The law of identity<BR/>c. The law of bivalence<BR/>d. If I think, then I exist.<BR/>e. Torturing the innocent for pleasure is always wrong.<BR/>f. Modus ponens<BR/>g. Modus tolens<BR/><BR/>4. Narrative or worldview contradict each other and cannot all be true. For example Islam denies, while Christianity affirms, that Jesus is God.<BR/><BR/>5. No one thinks that there is no difference between fictions and facts, between unicorns and corns, between elephants and elves.<BR/><BR/>6. Worldviews must be tested against reality through principles.<BR/>Does the worldview deny itself? Does the worldview jibe with external reality? Does the worldview provide a genuine way to live or is it impossible.<BR/><BR/>7. And so on!Douglas Groothuis, Ph.D.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08766692378954258034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148754150206031972006-05-27T12:22:00.000-06:002006-05-27T12:22:00.000-06:00Hi - I found your blog through a search on critici...Hi - I found your blog through a search on criticism and such. Nice post!<BR/><BR/>I see what you are saying: Connecting with others around an idol lacks the excellence of gathering around something real.<BR/><BR/>In the original post, the distinction between "idol" and "reality" was much more prevalent, and I would like to contribute to this line of thought.<BR/><BR/>After reading MacIntyre, if we accept the idea that humans are story-telling animals, and that stories are fictions (or at least highly selective and edited versions of "reality"), then doesn't the distinction between real and idol dissolve?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148706966821036182006-05-26T23:16:00.000-06:002006-05-26T23:16:00.000-06:00"Sometimes when one doesn't watch television, it b..."Sometimes when one doesn't watch television, it becomes possible that one doesn't really know what one has missed. "<BR/><BR/>True enough. But my point was not the level of talent, but the "idolatry"--of the tube and the talents, such as they are.<BR/><BR/>However, if you want to experience aesthetic excellence, immerse yourself in classic jazz, not TV culture (except when classic jazz is on TV, which is rare).Douglas Groothuis, Ph.D.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08766692378954258034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148696309999913672006-05-26T20:18:00.000-06:002006-05-26T20:18:00.000-06:00And yet Kelly Clarkson wins Grammies for her album...And yet Kelly Clarkson wins Grammies for her album -- she being among the first winners of the "American Idol" title.<BR/><BR/>Yeah, it's a replay of Ted Mack's Amateur hour, with a bit of British-accented insult thrown in -- but what's wrong with dreaming to win the talent contest?<BR/><BR/>Mediocrity? You've not listened to those guys belt them out, you confess. Johnny Unitas was such a mediocrity, in football. Jesse Owens was such a mediocrity, in running. <BR/><BR/>Sometimes when one doesn't watch television, it becomes possible that one doesn't really know what one has missed.Ed Darrellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10056539160596825210noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148670965244495042006-05-26T13:16:00.000-06:002006-05-26T13:16:00.000-06:00Becky,That "American Idol" celebrates mediocrity i...Becky,<BR/><BR/>That "American Idol" celebrates mediocrity is a noteworthy commentary on our culture. The failure of Modernity to produce the excellence it promised has produced the momentum behind this rush to embrace mediocrity. America swings with disturbing nonchalance on a fickle pendulum, idol to idol, unconcerned... that it swings over Hell. <BR/><BR/>-SusanSusanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10946914786780646364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148670282355410492006-05-26T13:04:00.000-06:002006-05-26T13:04:00.000-06:00To PS:To get a better sense of my concerns, read "...To PS:<BR/><BR/>To get a better sense of my concerns, read "Truth Decay," especially the appendix, "Television: Agent of Truth Decay." But first read a lot of the Bible, particularly what it says about worship, idols, godliness, and worldliness. See Romans 12:1-2; 1 John 2:15-7; Luke 16:14; and so much more. Read Psalm 1 also!<BR/><BR/><BR/>"What are you speaking to exactly in your post? Are you speaking out against the show American Idol? What the show represents? Perhaps the name the show chose? Television? The pitiful state of american culture? All of it?"<BR/><BR/>I am speaking out against all of it, the systematic, insideous, and supernatural stupefaction of America, God help us.Douglas Groothuis, Ph.D.https://www.blogger.com/profile/08766692378954258034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14410967.post-1148661745870920812006-05-26T10:42:00.000-06:002006-05-26T10:42:00.000-06:00The title of your post atracted my attention. I h...The title of your post atracted my attention. I happened to have watched the entire season of American Idol this year. Never thought I would have but I did.<BR/><BR/>What are you speaking to exactly in your post? Are you speaking out against the show American Idol? What the show represents? Perhaps the name the show chose? Television? The pitiful state of american culture? All of it?<BR/><BR/>Could be just me. I respect your writings but I am curious for a deeper explanation of this post - because I watched the show and do not see as many relationships between your points, what the show is about, and its overall affects on culture.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03679702879058315780noreply@blogger.com